Government of Canada announces "Open" Data Pilot Project

[Glen Newton]

Colan Schwartz on the gosling list pointed out the announcement of a
government of Canada "Open" Data Pilot Project
http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2011/0317a-eng.asp
http://www.data.gc.ca/

Here is the union of 2 responses I had on that list:

It claims to be Open Data, but it is not:
"You shall not use the data made available through the GC Open Data
Portal in any way which, in the opinion of Canada, may bring disrepute
to or prejudice the reputation of Canada."  So if your mashup shows
something that is - while being true - something some politician or
bureaucrat does not
like, you lose access to the data.

Other problems with the license also make it NotAnOpenDataLicense(tm).
It is a data license. And the data is free. It is not Open.

I'm getting tired of these governments doing this kind of deception.
It's called "openwashing":
http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/how_to_spot_openwashing.php

These links show the problems with these types of licenses:
- http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/07/its-not-open-data-so-stop-calling-it.html
- http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/08/what-is-open-gov-data-sunlight.html

"Canada may modify this agreement at any time, and such modifications
shall be effective immediately upon posting of the modified agreement
on the Open Data site. Your continued access or use of this data shall
be deemed your conclusive acceptance of the modified agreement."

This is evil.

Versioning of the license and the data to which it applies is
absolutely necessary.

Otherwise you can make an investment into an application which depends
on a dataset and then the license changes in a way that stops your
(legal) access. Or your app shows how bad the pollution in some river
is and the government is embarrassed and they interpret this as
bringing "disrepute to or prejudice the reputation of Canada.".

This causes a chill to go out to all developers, as they know that any
bad news mashups may put their access to data at risk.

-Glen

--

-

[James McKinney]

Minister Day has said that the "disrepute" clause will be removed. The
license is very likely to change for the better. The UK fixed its
license; I've no doubt Canada will, too. data.gc.ca is, after all, a
"pilot" project. I think a greater concern for people investing in
datasets is whether data.gc.ca makes it out of pilot phase.

On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 5:59 PM, Glen Newton <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Colan Schwartz on the gosling list pointed out the announcement of a
> government of Canada "Open" Data Pilot Project
> http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2011/0317a-eng.asp
> http://www.data.gc.ca/
>
> Here is the union of 2 responses I had on that list:
>
> It claims to be Open Data, but it is not:
> "You shall not use the data made available through the GC Open Data
> Portal in any way which, in the opinion of Canada, may bring disrepute
> to or prejudice the reputation of Canada."  So if your mashup shows
> something that is - while being true - something some politician or
> bureaucrat does not
> like, you lose access to the data.
>
> Other problems with the license also make it NotAnOpenDataLicense(tm).
> It is a data license. And the data is free. It is not Open.
>
> I'm getting tired of these governments doing this kind of deception.
> It's called "openwashing":
> http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/how_to_spot_openwashing.php
>
> These links show the problems with these types of licenses:
> - http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/07/its-not-open-data-so-stop-calling-it.html
> - http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/08/what-is-open-gov-data-sunlight.html
>
> "Canada may modify this agreement at any time, and such modifications
> shall be effective immediately upon posting of the modified agreement
> on the Open Data site. Your continued access or use of this data shall
> be deemed your conclusive acceptance of the modified agreement."
>
> This is evil.
>
> Versioning of the license and the data to which it applies is
> absolutely necessary.
>
> Otherwise you can make an investment into an application which depends
> on a dataset and then the license changes in a way that stops your
> (legal) access. Or your app shows how bad the pollution in some river
> is and the government is embarrassed and they interpret this as
> bringing "disrepute to or prejudice the reputation of Canada.".
>
> This causes a chill to go out to all developers, as they know that any
> bad news mashups may put their access to data at risk.
>
> -Glen
>
> --
>
> -
> _______________________________________________
> CivicAccess-discuss mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.pwd.ca/mailman/listinfo/civicaccess-discuss
>

[Tracey P. Lauriault]

The Access to Information Act has parts that relate to the disclosure
of information in the public interest.

I think we need to read these acts a bit more.  I was very surprised
to find such strong language in support of access.  I am guessing that
a license would be weaker than an act.

http://laws.justice.gc.ca/PDF/Statute/A/A-1.pdf
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/a-1/

On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 5:59 PM, Glen Newton <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Colan Schwartz on the gosling list pointed out the announcement of a
> government of Canada "Open" Data Pilot Project
> http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2011/0317a-eng.asp
> http://www.data.gc.ca/
>
> Here is the union of 2 responses I had on that list:
>
> It claims to be Open Data, but it is not:
> "You shall not use the data made available through the GC Open Data
> Portal in any way which, in the opinion of Canada, may bring disrepute
> to or prejudice the reputation of Canada."  So if your mashup shows
> something that is - while being true - something some politician or
> bureaucrat does not
> like, you lose access to the data.
>
> Other problems with the license also make it NotAnOpenDataLicense(tm).
> It is a data license. And the data is free. It is not Open.
>
> I'm getting tired of these governments doing this kind of deception.
> It's called "openwashing":
> http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/how_to_spot_openwashing.php
>
> These links show the problems with these types of licenses:
> - http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/07/its-not-open-data-so-stop-calling-it.html
> - http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/08/what-is-open-gov-data-sunlight.html
>
> "Canada may modify this agreement at any time, and such modifications
> shall be effective immediately upon posting of the modified agreement
> on the Open Data site. Your continued access or use of this data shall
> be deemed your conclusive acceptance of the modified agreement."
>
> This is evil.
>
> Versioning of the license and the data to which it applies is
> absolutely necessary.
>
> Otherwise you can make an investment into an application which depends
> on a dataset and then the license changes in a way that stops your
> (legal) access. Or your app shows how bad the pollution in some river
> is and the government is embarrassed and they interpret this as
> bringing "disrepute to or prejudice the reputation of Canada.".
>
> This causes a chill to go out to all developers, as they know that any
> bad news mashups may put their access to data at risk.
>
> -Glen
>
> --
>
> -
> _______________________________________________
> CivicAccess-discuss mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.pwd.ca/mailman/listinfo/civicaccess-discuss
>

--
Tracey P. Lauriault
613-234-2805
http://traceyplauriault.ca/

[Russell McOrmond-3]

I have asked several people over the years, but nobody seems to have a definitive idea of the license on the results of an ATIP request.  Some at the commissioners office speculated it is a private license (research and private study sound familiar from somewhere? :-), but that I would need permission to publish.  I have of course always just published and will wait any response...

On Mar 18, 2011 12:13 AM, "Tracey P. Lauriault" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> The Access to Information Act has parts that relate to the disclosure
> of information in the public interest.
>
> I think we need to read these acts a bit more. I was very surprised
> to find such strong language in support of access. I am guessing that
> a license would be weaker than an act.
>
> http://laws.justice.gc.ca/PDF/Statute/A/A-1.pdf
> http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/a-1/
>
> On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 5:59 PM, Glen Newton <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Colan Schwartz on the gosling list pointed out the announcement of a
>> government of Canada "Open" Data Pilot Project
>> http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2011/0317a-eng.asp
>> http://www.data.gc.ca/
>>
>> Here is the union of 2 responses I had on that list:
>>
>> It claims to be Open Data, but it is not:
>> "You shall not use the data made available through the GC Open Data
>> Portal in any way which, in the opinion of Canada, may bring disrepute
>> to or prejudice the reputation of Canada."  So if your mashup shows
>> something that is - while being true - something some politician or
>> bureaucrat does not
>> like, you lose access to the data.
>>
>> Other problems with the license also make it NotAnOpenDataLicense(tm).
>> It is a data license. And the data is free. It is not Open.
>>
>> I'm getting tired of these governments doing this kind of deception.
>> It's called "openwashing":
>> http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/how_to_spot_openwashing.php
>>
>> These links show the problems with these types of licenses:
>> - http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/07/its-not-open-data-so-stop-calling-it.html
>> - http://zzzoot.blogspot.com/2010/08/what-is-open-gov-data-sunlight.html
>>
>> "Canada may modify this agreement at any time, and such modifications
>> shall be effective immediately upon posting of the modified agreement
>> on the Open Data site. Your continued access or use of this data shall
>> be deemed your conclusive acceptance of the modified agreement."
>>
>> This is evil.
>>
>> Versioning of the license and the data to which it applies is
>> absolutely necessary.
>>
>> Otherwise you can make an investment into an application which depends
>> on a dataset and then the license changes in a way that stops your
>> (legal) access. Or your app shows how bad the pollution in some river
>> is and the government is embarrassed and they interpret this as
>> bringing "disrepute to or prejudice the reputation of Canada.".
>>
>> This causes a chill to go out to all developers, as they know that any
>> bad news mashups may put their access to data at risk.
>>
>> -Glen
>>
>> --
>>
>> -
>> _______________________________________________
>> CivicAccess-discuss mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.pwd.ca/mailman/listinfo/civicaccess-discuss
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Tracey P. Lauriault
> 613-234-2805
> http://traceyplauriault.ca/
> _______________________________________________
> CivicAccess-discuss mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.pwd.ca/mailman/listinfo/civicaccess-discuss