601 Booth st. / 601 rue Booth
"You are way off base here." and "I'm sorry but this paragraph is woefully ignorant."
That's a bit harsh. Please check the etiquette page to see the norms for the site. This is not a rough and tumble linux-user group mailing list. We have lots of people with lots of different backgrounds, there are going to be lots of misunderstandings and we've got to keep things really . . . civil ;-)
> My turn.
>
> On Thursday 04 May 2006 8:46 am, Grignon, Alain wrote:
> > Richard,
> >
> > I may be way off base here, and please step in if I am but I believe
> > the Linux debate/browser compatibility doesn't fall within the scope
> > of CivicAccess. At least as I understand it.
>
> You are way off base here. What makes you think the browser debate
> doesn't include open standards on the internet? Word processors and
> website code are both simply bits of instructions. When I as a citizen
> want to fully participate in government and gathering or submitting
> data who cares if I am denied by code on the net or code residing on
> my computer? The point is I'm being denied access, period. It's my
> RIGHT as a citizen of this country to expect equal access. Read more
> information on the history of the internet, TCP/IP, HTTP, the battle
> fought and won back then are at risk by laisse faire people who let corporations control our access to information.
>
> > That doesn't
> > necessarily mean it has to be accessible to all browser types/Oses.
> > Anyone try using BeOS? Unix? Somewhere a line must be drawn in order
> > to allow government web services to evolve. Being a public servant
> > myself, I graple with these issues daily. There is a balance to be
> > truck between making things accessible and keeping inline with current technologies.
> >
>
> I'm sorry but this paragraph is woefully ignorant. If a browser can an
> operating system that is compliant with http 4.1 transitional, and has
> a TCP/IP stack it's nobody's business if I made my own operating
> system from scratch. You're missing the entire point of standards,
> it's to ensure compatability not to be an impediment to technological
> evolution. The alternative is going back to using Archie (the
> University of Minnesota own this software and has threatened to
> extract royalty fees from every user), or Compuserve, or regressing
> back to unix days when many protocols were created by each university.
> In fact this is where TCP/IP came from it's an amalgamation of 32
> different protocols. Previous to this you had to be a hacker and know
> byte endianness, and script wrappers between terminal "standards".
> This debate is entirely appropraite to open document formats and
> access to information. For clarity (and in case you're using BeOS or
> Unix, those great unknowns apparently) here is the mission from CivicAccess's website.
>
> Citizens for Open Access to Civic Information and Data (CivicAccess)
> is a group of citizens which believes all levels of government should
> make civic information and data accessible at no cost in open formats to their citizens.
> We believe this is necessary to allow citizens to fully participate in
> the democractic process of an "information society."
> Objectives:
> To encourage all levels of governments (county, municipal, provincial,
> federal) to make civic data and information available to citizens
> without restrictions, at no cost, and in useable open formats.
> To encourage the development of citizen projects using civic data and
> information Making civic data and information freely available to
> citizens is important
> because:
> Citizen participation in decision-making is fundamental to democracy
> Good decisions are made by informed citizens Quality civic data and
> information are fundamental to keeping citizens informed in an
> "information society"
> Taxes have already paid for civic data and information; therefore
> these should be made available at no cost to citizens Citizen
> projects using civic data will generate innovative solutions to
> social, economic and environmental problems Citizen projects using
> civic data will allow citizens to creatively plan their communities
> This is what a democracy looks like!
>
> Jason
>
>
> > Just my thoughts.
> >
> >
> > Alain Grignon
> > Landslide GIS Specialist / Spécialiste SIG en glissements de
> > terrains Geological Survey of Canada / Commission géologique du
> > Canada
> > 601 Booth st. / 601 rue Booth
> > Ottawa, Ont.
> > Tel: (613) 947-8773
> >
http://landslides.nrcan.gc.ca/> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:
[hidden email]
> > [mailto:
[hidden email]] Sent: May 3,
> > 2006 10:57 PM
> > To:
[hidden email]
> > Subject: [CivicAccess-discuss] Canada Census on line
> >
> > Hey all,
> >
> > Not sure if this falls into civicaccess's mandate but I figured I
> > would pass it on.
> >
> > Today I tried to fill out my census info on-line (www.census2006.ca).
> > When I tried to get started I got this
> >
> > "Your browser does not meet the minimum requirements to access this
> > site
> >
> > The current version of browser you are using is not supported by this site.
> >
> > To download a supported version of browser, please refer to: To
> > download the required software. If you do not wish to download a new
> > browser, you can complete your paper questionnaire and return it by
> > mail in the envelope provided."
> >
> > So I called the help desk. I asked them why I get this messages and
> > that I met all the requirements with one small exception. I was on
> > Linux. I was told that Linux was not supported and I would have to
> > use Windows or Mac to access the site. I asked him why this was and
> > the help desk guy told me that as Linux was not all that popular so
> > it was not supported and would not likely be supported anytime soon.
> > I took some time to try and educate this gentleman about how the
> > Internet should not have a specific operating system requirement but I don't think he was really listening or cared.
> >
> > Is there any one I can contact on this in the government or is there
> > a anything the group can do to bring open standers argument to
> > Census Canada's website? As this is census update time I am sure
> > that there are other Linux users out there that are having issues. I
> > am not pushing a Linux agenda here but I am pushing for open
> > standards for the government of Canada's website.
> >
> > I know the group is just starting to get going but is this maybe a
> > good starting point for some action?
> >
> > If not any help in pointing me in the direction of someone I can
> > contact to complain would be much appreciated.
> >
> > +------------------------------------+
> > Best regards,
> > -Richard Houston
> > -R.L.H. Consulting
> > -E-Mail
[hidden email]
> > -WWW
http://www.rlhc.net> > -Blog
http://www.rlhc.net/blog/> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > CivicAccess-discuss mailing list
> >
[hidden email]
> >
http://civicaccess.ca/mailman/listinfo/civicaccess-discuss_civicacce> > ss.ca
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > CivicAccess-discuss mailing list
> >
[hidden email]
> >
http://civicaccess.ca/mailman/listinfo/civicaccess-discuss_civicacce> > ss.ca
>
> --
> Software shouldn't be your struggle
>
> _______________________________________________
> CivicAccess-discuss mailing list
>
[hidden email]
>
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>