Fwd: Minister of Industry - Statement on2011 Census

[Heather Morrison]

I understand that the census work has been outsourced to Lockheed  
Martin.  In Lockheed we trust?

I agree that the odds of a hitler arising in Canada anytime soon are  
extremely small.  But let's not forget - Hitler's regime had a major  
impact on many countries that nothing to do with electing Hitler.

There is a group called "Genocide Watch".  I don't know much about  
them, but would like to point out that according to their website  
there are over 30 countries currently on their genocide, politicide,  
or mass atrocity list, with 8 listed in the genocide category per se.
Details at:
http://www.genocidewatch.org/aboutgenocide/countriesatrisk2010.html

Happily, Canada is not listed.  However, many of our citizens and  
residents come from these countries and/or have family or other ties  
with people in these countries.

The time to protect our privacy, IMHO, is not AFTER some of our fellow  
citizens have suddenly disappeared; it is precisely in times such as  
these, when we have peace and a government that we can trust.

In my opinion, reflecting on all the genocides of the past century and  
the possibility for more, if the government comes knocking on your  
door to ask you about your religion, ethnicity, country of origin,  
etc., the appropriate answer is "none of your business".  Better yet,  
let's ask our government to quit collecting this information, and make  
sure that any such information previously connected is deliberately  
and permanently disabled so that the information can never be  
connected with individuals.

My two bits.

Heather Morrison
[hidden email]



On 20-Jul-10, at 2:19 PM, Drew Mcpherson wrote:

> Also, with the way things are tending towards giving special  
> privileges to racial minorities it might actually be to one's  
> benefit to be identified as such.  I don't think there's any danger  
> of a "hitler" rising to power in Canada any time soon.
>
> ~Drew
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Shawn Simister" <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Monday, July 19, 2010 4:04 PM
> To: "civicaccess discuss" <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [CivicAccess-discuss] Fwd: Minister of Industry -  
> Statement on2011 Census
>
>> I'd go one step further and say that opting out of the census would  
>> do next to nothing to protect you from genocide. Think of how many  
>> emails you've sent over the past decade and what they say about  
>> you. Same goes for telephone calls. Or if you use electronic  
>> payment like Interac or credit cards, they can infer things like  
>> gender, ethnicity or even religion with a decent amount of accuracy  
>> from your purchase history. Personally, I'm more concerned about  
>> the threats of the 21st century like flu pandemics and climate  
>> change than I am about repeating the mistakes of the 20th century  
>> and to solve these problems we need good quality open data.
>>
>> Shawn
>>
>> Drew Mcpherson wrote:
>>> That's an interesting perspective I hadn't thought of.  Certainly  
>>> it's possible.  Personally, I'd attempt a preventive solution in  
>>> terms of a watchdog to keep government in line rather than  
>>> clamping off the flow of information.  It seems that the natural  
>>> instinct to cut off information flow in order to avoid atrocities  
>>> actually results in allowing those atrocities to occur  
>>> undetected.  So if you're worried about how your information will  
>>> be used, I say turn up the volume on that information and catch  
>>> the would-be data abusers before they can get a foothold towards  
>>> rising to power.
>>>
>>> ~Drew
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------
>>> From: "Heather Morrison" <[hidden email]>
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 18, 2010 7:11 PM
>>> To: "civicaccess discuss" <[hidden email]>
>>> Subject: Re: [CivicAccess-discuss] Fwd: Minister of Industry -  
>>> Statement on2011 Census
>>>
>>>> My two bits:
>>>>
>>>> As I recall, I was one of those selected to fill out the long  
>>>> form in the past, and I certainly expressed very strongly at the  
>>>> time my concern about being forced to fill out this form.
>>>>
>>>> Some things to think about:
>>>>
>>>> The lastest census form gives the option to make your data  
>>>> available openly, albeit long after your death.  What bothers me  
>>>> about this?  In the past century, we have seen a number of  
>>>> genocides.  I am a very optimistic person; I believe that the  
>>>> problems with climate change can be solved, and that we can have  
>>>> peace on earth, and that we should therefore get cracking and  
>>>> make these things happen.  However, it my opinion it would be  
>>>> naive to assume that this will happen.
>>>>
>>>> Any information that I include on a census form to be released  
>>>> even in the distant future, particularly along the lines of  
>>>> religion or ethnicity, could result in discrimination or even a  
>>>> death sentence for my descendants.  There have been times when  
>>>> merely being identified as a Jew, or a Hutu, put people on a  
>>>> death list.
>>>>
>>>> Even here in Canada, there have been times when being a First  
>>>> Nations person meant being sent to a residential school to  
>>>> eliminate the influence of your culture.  Today, in the post-9/11  
>>>> world, racial profiling is actively practiced.  During WWII, we  
>>>> rounded up all the Japanese people and put them in internment  
>>>> camps.
>>>>
>>>> It is interesting to me that so many of my fellow Canadians have  
>>>> such confidence in our government - both current and future -  
>>>> that the possibility of our own government misusing such  
>>>> information as is collected via the long form of the census  
>>>> doesn't seem to be occurring to people.  We are fortunate indeed  
>>>> in Canada, and my own confidence  in this area is strong; but it  
>>>> is not 100%, and I would prefer that  our government only collect  
>>>> such information tied to individuals as it really needs to govern  
>>>> the country and provide services to Canadians.
>>>>
>>>> best,
>>>>
>>>> Heather Morrison
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> On 18-Jul-10, at 3:54 AM, Karl Dubost wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> this comes to an interesting discussion. I do
>>>>> not think there will be any gain into it if we
>>>>> start by making binary comments about it.
>>>>>
>>>>>      "In the past, the Government of Canada
>>>>>      received complaints about the long-form
>>>>>      census from citizens who felt it was an
>>>>>      intrusion of their privacy. The
>>>>>      government does not think it is
>>>>>      necessary for Canadians to provide
>>>>>      Statistics Canada with the number of
>>>>>      bedrooms in their home, or what time of
>>>>>      the day they leave for work, or how long
>>>>>      it takes them to get there."
>>>>>
>>>>> This statement says that some citizens are
>>>>> uncomfortable with the data which are collected
>>>>> about them. It tells me that more and more people
>>>>> are aware of privacy matters. And that is good.
>>>>>
>>>>> That is good specifically in the context of networks.
>>>>> http://www.la-grange.net/2010/05/28/karl-dubost-privacy-ws
>>>>>
>>>>> Sharing your information means that you have to know how
>>>>> it will be used and for which purpose. Specifically when
>>>>> this information is highly connected to personnalized and
>>>>> geolocalized data.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the networked world, it just takes *one* mistake for
>>>>> getting the information out there and get a social network
>>>>> catastrophe.
>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AOL_search_data_scandal
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes these data are definitely useful and yes it is cool to
>>>>> work with them for plenty of purpose. But we have to be
>>>>> careful of the society we want too.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Karl Dubost
>>>>> Montréal, QC, Canada
>>>>> http://www.la-grange.net/karl/
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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