City of Saskatoon - open data for developers?

[Tracey P. Lauriault]

http://www2.canada.com/saskatoonstarphoenix/news/story.html?id=53855a84-1473-442a-983e-e733a1e131a0

Why would a city go open data only for developers? Stephen Peacock's statement seems at odds with the whole idea of open data:

"From my perspective I want to find out what developers want from the city rather than putting out data that's of no use and wasting taxpayer's money. We're going to start developing data sets that people are going to want to consume. We're asking, 'What data do you want?"

The City of Sastkatoon has SRIC's (http://www.saskatoonric.ca/sric_operations/initiatives_working_groups/sric_evaluation_working_group) with many organizations sitting at round tables trying to tackle a number of social and economic issues which require data, and a fantastic Public Health portal that is disseminating data freely and that was not mentioned in this article - CommunityView Collaboration (http://www.communityview.ca/).

It seems like Corporate Services is not aware of the other open data initiatives in its own city and also of the great work many other sectors are involved in when it comes to data.

t

--

Tracey P. Lauriault
613-234-2805
 

[Liam Currie]

Thanks for the link Tracy.  Sadly this type of move isn't really surprising to me.  When I was doing my undergrad in Saskatoon I tried a few times to get the city to open up its council meeting videos and host a discussion board.  I had a few Councillors on-side (principally Darren Hill), but when I approached the city's communication manager I was told that this would not happen because the city did not accept "anonymous criticism".  That and the fact that she was woefully ignorant about online tools was discouraging.  

I found this quote FTA to be particularly troubling: 

"I think we have to ask what the community at large wants to see," Jones said. "I don't think they'd want to see a council minutes app. But there could be a one-stop shop for City of Saskatoon. Find out about garbage pickup, find out about my neighbourhood, even register for events. "  

They're really only interested in this as a service delivery mechanism.  This is the safe route for them: don't take any risks, don't open up data to people who might use it for unexpected purposes, stay in control of everything.  Hopefully there is enough local pressure to open up more data to the public as time goes on.  

(P.S. Tracy, I am doing work on evaluating local municipal open data initiatives across Canada.  If you're interested I'd love some feedback. Just shoot me an email. BTW, we met at the CIPPIC salon at UofO a couple of months back.  I was the bald guy you had coffee with before the event.)

-Liam 

--------------------

Message: 3
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2012 10:33:25 -0400
From: "Tracey P. Lauriault" <[hidden email]>
To: civicaccess discuss <[hidden email]>
Subject: [CivicAccess-discuss] City of Saskatoon - open data for
       developers?
Message-ID:
       <CAPT_w+nCzEPihMh-2dbq=ENAABy_ObWMXaAGXNyOzwB=[hidden email]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

http://www2.canada.com/saskatoonstarphoenix/news/story.html?id=53855a84-1473-442a-983e-e733a1e131a0

Why would a city go open data only for developers? Stephen Peacock's
statement seems at odds with the whole idea of open data:

"From my perspective I want to find out what developers want from the city
rather than putting out data that's of no use and wasting taxpayer's money.
We're going to start developing data sets that people are going to want to
consume. We're asking, 'What data do you want?"

The City of Sastkatoon has SRIC's (
http://www.saskatoonric.ca/sric_operations/initiatives_working_groups/sric_evaluation_working_group)
with many organizations sitting at round tables trying to tackle a number
of social and economic issues which require data, and a fantastic Public
Health portal that is disseminating data freely and that was not mentioned
in this article - CommunityView Collaboration (http://www.communityview.ca/
).

It seems like Corporate Services is not aware of the other open data
initiatives in its own city and also of the great work many other sectors
are involved in when it comes to data.

t

--
Tracey P. Lauriault
<a href="tel:[phone]" value="[phone]">613-234-2805

[Andrew Dyck]

I think it's great to Saskatoon moving in this direction and I congratulate them in taking some first steps. In Regina, we had a little different experience and if there are any City of Saskatoon folks watching this list I invite them to get in contact with me to discuss. 

The approach in Regina was to throw some of the data out there for developers to use (the low-hanging fruit of course) and see what they could do with it. This opened up a fantastic dialogue between developers and City staff where both sides were learning about each other and how to go forwards. Often times, developers don't know what data the City has and they won't know how great it is to work with opendata or the potential opportunities until they see some data. On the other hand, City staff in Regina were excited to see the true civic engagement at our YQR hackathon and they got excited about the possibilities.

Much of this the people on this list already know. I'm just a little excited to see Saskatoon jumping into the open data ring and hopeful that some of the same great relationship developers, City staff and other open data/open gov enthusiasts in Regina have built is replicated in Saskatoon.

Cheers,

Andrew

On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 11:26 AM, Liam Currie <[hidden email]> wrote:

Thanks for the link Tracy.  Sadly this type of move isn't really surprising to me.  When I was doing my undergrad in Saskatoon I tried a few times to get the city to open up its council meeting videos and host a discussion board.  I had a few Councillors on-side (principally Darren Hill), but when I approached the city's communication manager I was told that this would not happen because the city did not accept "anonymous criticism".  That and the fact that she was woefully ignorant about online tools was discouraging.  

I found this quote FTA to be particularly troubling: 

"I think we have to ask what the community at large wants to see," Jones said. "I don't think they'd want to see a council minutes app. But there could be a one-stop shop for City of Saskatoon. Find out about garbage pickup, find out about my neighbourhood, even register for events. "  

They're really only interested in this as a service delivery mechanism.  This is the safe route for them: don't take any risks, don't open up data to people who might use it for unexpected purposes, stay in control of everything.  Hopefully there is enough local pressure to open up more data to the public as time goes on.  

(P.S. Tracy, I am doing work on evaluating local municipal open data initiatives across Canada.  If you're interested I'd love some feedback. Just shoot me an email. BTW, we met at the CIPPIC salon at UofO a couple of months back.  I was the bald guy you had coffee with before the event.)

-Liam 

--------------------

Message: 3
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2012 10:33:25 -0400
From: "Tracey P. Lauriault" <[hidden email]>
To: civicaccess discuss <[hidden email]>
Subject: [CivicAccess-discuss] City of Saskatoon - open data for
       developers?
Message-ID:
       <CAPT_w+nCzEPihMh-2dbq=ENAABy_ObWMXaAGXNyOzwB=[hidden email]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

http://www2.canada.com/saskatoonstarphoenix/news/story.html?id=53855a84-1473-442a-983e-e733a1e131a0

Why would a city go open data only for developers? Stephen Peacock's
statement seems at odds with the whole idea of open data:

"From my perspective I want to find out what developers want from the city
rather than putting out data that's of no use and wasting taxpayer's money.
We're going to start developing data sets that people are going to want to
consume. We're asking, 'What data do you want?"

The City of Sastkatoon has SRIC's (
http://www.saskatoonric.ca/sric_operations/initiatives_working_groups/sric_evaluation_working_group)
with many organizations sitting at round tables trying to tackle a number
of social and economic issues which require data, and a fantastic Public
Health portal that is disseminating data freely and that was not mentioned
in this article - CommunityView Collaboration (http://www.communityview.ca/
).

It seems like Corporate Services is not aware of the other open data
initiatives in its own city and also of the great work many other sectors
are involved in when it comes to data.

t

--
Tracey P. Lauriault
<a href="tel:[phone]" value="[phone]" target="_blank">613-234-2805

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